Interview with Wanna Thianin

1st PART: Woman’s history comprehension/understanding

• Can you present yourself in a few words and explain us what is your job/responsibilities?

I’m responsible for chartering and operating so basically what I’ve been doing before was a bit different, I was more into operation, I had to give instructions day to day to ships and crews, showing them where to go and what to do. What I’m doing more now is commercial shattering, to hire other other ships, to rent other ships to carry our cargo. I have to give informations about our cargo, like the weight, the shortage, the time loading and charging...

Because we have two parts, we have our own ships to carry our cargos but sometimes we don't have enough capacity and we have to rent other ships. I have to deal with many types of people, the vessel owner, the operation manager, the master of the ship.

• How did you come to engineering and sciences ?

Actually I have a master degree in communication in english. Before, I was working in an other job which was already technical. I was a middle person between the ship owner and the client.

And them the shipping market slowed a lot, 2 or 3 years ago. So it was more secure for me to come in a company like Colas.

But here I deal more with the technical, because I have to work with the technical department, when we have to repair a boat for example, or to do maintenance. With my master degree of english, I could do a lot of different things in different field. At first, I worked in a company to do administration, which requires a lot of english. But it was a routine, I don't really like paper work, and I wanted more challenge. Actually, when I was in high school I wanted to be an engineer, but I was not really good in maths, I was a bit lazy !

But as I told you, I found in my first job paper work more boring every day. So I wanted to change to my originel idea, engineering. But it was too late, you can't be an engineer without diploma. So I tried to find a job closed to the dream thing. And I kind of like it ! It's good to go to the field, to see the ships, get on board. I think engineering is cool, you have to think, to go outside, you have your own project and they are different each time, whereas for paper work you stay in the office and you do a bit of this, a bit of that, and at the end you have the impression to do nothing!

• Did you have to face any difficulty as a woman in your studies/in your job? Or do you think being a woman facilitated it ?

At the beginning, it was difficult, because in Thailand if you want to be part of the crew you have to have graduated from a school called Motion traing school. And girls can't go to this school, it is only oppened to boys. And when these men have been part of the crew for some time,

some of them come on shore and work in the field. SO if you are a girl working in the field, it's sure that everybody know that you haven't done this school, and they may think you are not skilled for that. And so directing them is a bit difficult at the beginning. But it's not so difficult, because when they see you know how to work and you know what you are talking about, then it's ok. In my previous company I was the only girls !

• What are the special qualifications you need to have for your job ?

You have to know about shipping, the whole process of shipping, you have to knpw who is who and how the ship works. You have to know how to speak english. We have only 2 or 3 thai ship owners, the other are english speakers.

• What are your everyday motivations?

What I prefer in my job, even The challenge when you have to negociate the chartering contract. You have to fight for 50 cents.

• Do you have to move abroad for your job?

I've always been here, but I know that if I want to grow more in the company, I should have gone more international from the beginning.

• How do you conciliate professional and personal life?

I'm not married, but I have a boyfriend and I'm planning to have a kid. But I think I can manage. even now I manage to conciliate my professional  and personnal life. I have hobbies, I go dancing, running, I go out. I'm not worried about having a child for my work. Because I can see the character of my partner. I know he will not let me with the baby alone ! He would help me to manage, and also we could hire a nanny, to make it more easy and so I can concentrate when I'm at work. I don't think it would affect a lot.

• Could you tell us professional realizations you are proud of?

Hum, difficult question, because I'm never happy when I do something, I always want it to be better! I've been working and studying, I managed to do both in the same time since I was young (14). I'm proud of this.

• What do you like in this company?

In this company I can learn. And it has a lot of stability.

2nd PART:  General debate on woman engineer: differences and new things a woman can bring in a male team

• Do you think men and women work differently? Could you give us concrete examples (personal works, project works)?

The way they work is different. Men when they work they look out more into big pictures, women look more into little details. When men want something to be done, they don't care the way they do it, they just want it to be done. But women look more on how to do it.

Women are more personal. For example if somebody ask my male collegue for information, they will answer yes or no, depending on if he has it or not. But if somebody ask me and I have, I would more think "I can give, but do I want to, should I give him or not?". And on the other hand, if I haven't, I won't answer "I have not". I would think more on how to help this person, or where I could find it.

What I don't like with men, it is that sometimes they do things too fast, and sometimes they ask other people to do things for them without thinking what they asked.

What I like when I work with men is their ability to take decisions, and that you can say whatever to them, they don't take it personnaly. You cannot say the same to your female collegues, because they won't take the words litteraly, they will take them with feelings. An other thing is that women are more organized, and are able to do several things in the same time.

• Do you think that gender diversity in a team is helpful for working atmosphere and/or is linked to team performance?

It depends on the situation and the people. In a meeting, I would say I prefer gender diversity, for the atmosphere more than for the productivity. But for sure if you do a meeting with only women, you won't go nowhere, because everybody goes into details, and you never get the point. And men do more jokes.

Vidéo

• Can you present yourself in a few words ?

Hi, my name is Wanna, I am rsponsible for chartering, chartering means to hire big ships to carry our cargos, and we carry the bitumen, which is asphalt, and I've been in this job for 4-5 years now, and I love the job. At the beginning I wanted to be an engineer, and I could't get a job as an engineer, so I tried to do something that is clother as engineer that I could, that is why I came to this job.

• Which advice could you give to young women who hesitate to start engineering studies ?

Ok, I think my advice is : when I was a little girl I wanted to be an engineer, but I didn't do very well in mathematics, I was a little bit lazy, "well doesn't matter" I thought at that time, but later I thought "it might be interesting and challenging to be an engineer", so I think if I had a chance, I would go back, and try to learn, study, and become an engineer like I dream. So I think if you guys want to be an engineer, you shouldn't hesitate otherwise you would regret it like me.

• What has been your biggest difficulty as a woman engineer ?

The biggest difficulty at the work is having to prove you point in a really short time with all the support that sometimes you don't have, and how not just to prove your point but across as well, and how to communicate with the people.

• What has been your biggest satisfaction as a woman engineer ?

The satisfaction is that I have done things by myself since I was young until now, and I sort of build my own life by myself, and even now I think I would be more satisfied if I could do something more exciting, being an engineer for example would be more exciting!

• What is your next challenge ?

I want to have my own company, something really exciting, in ten years for example!

Interview with Prom Porn Kanjanarat

1st PART: Woman’s history comprehension/understanding

• Can you present yourself in a few words and explain us what is your job/responsibilities?

I graduate with a bachelor degree in chemical engineering in 1998. Then I did a master in petrochemical technology. I use to work in Petrochemical engineering. Then I worked on the processing side for 3 years. But at that time, I found that in the company the priority was given to the commercial side more than the technical side. The engineering side was not the priority. If a decision had to be taken for development of such or such product, the commercial was the one to take it, even if he has no knowledge about the technical. I felt quite humiliated. So I wonder: “Is it difficult for an engineer to understand the commercial side?” And I realize that no. So after 3 years I entered the largest bank in Thailand. I was surprised they accepted me because I had neither diploma nor MBA. But my friend who was in the bank told me “You know, in banking, there are a lot of economists, but they don’t know about the technical side. And sometimes bank have to finance technical project so it’s good if some engineers who know about it work in banks.” And she told me that I could learn financing from the employees of the bank and in return I could help them to understand the projects to finance of refinery, power plant, and petrochemical. I stayed 10 years in the bank and then I was hired in a rating agency. After 3 years I was hired as the director of finance of Tipco, here in Bangkok. It’s my third year. I manage 3 or 4 people directly, but indirectly 20 people. In finance we have 99% of women.

• How did you come to engineering and sciences?

During my secondary school, I found I was very good on chemistry. I didn’t like math or informatics or electrical and civil, I thought it was more for men. I had to choose between environment engineering, chemical or biology. And I think I choose the right one! For me civil engineering was for men because I thought that you have to deal with workers and to go on jobsites. In my year in the faculty we were only 10% of girls in total, and really few of them choose civil engineering. But what is sure is that I didn’t want to do literature or philosophy. When I had to choose the 3 best majors for university, I choose first engineering, second pharmacy and third accounting. As my mother is housekeeper and my father editor, I think maybe it’s more my older brother, who was in mechanical engineering, who has shown me the way to engineering. After, he told me “ok, you want to do engineering, but you have to choose which field!” He advised me to choose IT engineering or industrial. Computers, forget about it! And industrial, I didn’t know. So I asked him what about chemical engineering and he told me that if I choose so, I would have to go in factories, or plants, or refineries. But I told him I don’t mind! Here industrial it is more management of factories, not on the process line.

• Did you have to face any difficulty as a woman in your studies/in your job? Or do you think being a woman facilitated it?

We were 5 girls among 35 students in my university. But it was not difficult. Boys were taking care of us! To find job, it was not so difficult. I mean, at the entrance level, it is not difficult. But if you want to be promoted, you need to be outstanding, far more than men. It’s a question of recognition. I think maybe people think if you have to face problems at top level management, men are better to solve them. And subordinates accept more a decision taken by a man than a woman. Women of my age are never at the top level management. They may be at the level of technical manager, but it’s nearly always the best.

• What are the special qualifications you need to have for your job?

For finance manager, the most important is that you have to think fast. In finance you have to deal with money. You have to be careful. And the second one is that you need to have good negotiation skills. And you have to have good analytic skills to see what happens in the finance of the company.

• What are your everyday motivations?

Everyday something unexpected happens, so every day when I wake up I wonder: What will I save today? It’s good to be challenged. But too much pressure is not good either!

• Do you have to move abroad for your job?

Sometimes I need to travel, for example in Malaysia or China. But now thanks to new technologies I can do videoconference.

• How do you conciliate professional and personal life?

I don’t have children. Regarding my personal life, what helps me to conciliate it with my professional one is that every day when I wake up I pray and I meditate. I’m Buddhism, and it relaxes me to do this meditation every day!

• Could you tell us professional realizations you are proud of?

I’m not sure I can say anything for Tipco because I’m here since only 3 years, but for my previous work, in the bank for example, people recognizes me. I could deliver the work they wanted, and sometimes better than what they expected. This is really important for me. When I switched from engineering to finance, I didn’t know anything about finance. There was another man who had a master degree in finance. But for the same project, the guy was not able to do this project, and me I was. My boss said that, not to me but to other colleagues and I heard it after. I was very proud. So I believe that if you really want to learn, you can! Finally I wanted to understand really well about commercial so I took another MBA on the commercial side. But for sure with my clients for refineries it was really efficient to have both skills, technical and financial.

• What do you like in this company?

You know, I have been working in a bank then a credit rating agency. Now I’m on the other side. I am the one who has to help Tipco to answer the questions of the bank, to help them to keep or improving their rating. It’s really challenging! The first day of work in Tipco, I was lost! Everything was new to me! But after, you learn and it’s better every day!

2nd PART:  General debate on woman engineer: differences and new things a woman can bring in a male team

• Do you think men and women work differently? Could you give us concrete examples (personal works, project works)?

Yes. Men and women have different characteristic. For example, men take decision fast. When they take decision, they take it and they go for it. Women think a lot before taking decision, and their decisions are more precised. And what is the best depends on the case. On critical situations, men can take decisions faster and it is better. On other situations it is better to think longer. In term of communication, I think there is a difference between west and east. Men are straighter and women think more before saying the things. And for the west/east difference, I think in the west women can say more what they fell. For example when I am in a meeting, if I don’t agree, I can’t say “I don’t agree” like this. I have to think how to say it.

• Do you think that gender diversity in a team is helpful for working atmosphere and/or is linked to team performance?

In my team, I prefer to have both men and women. But sometimes I prefer to work with men, because if I have to say something to a woman, I have to think more. But actually it’s difficult for the men to work in accounting because they need to be more detailed. Women are more detailed because it’s nature. Women are more patient. They can pay more attention on the work. Concerning emotions, I think it’s good to have some because you pay more attention on the people. But if you have too much, it confuses you in your work and it’s not good.

Video

• Can you present yourself in a few words ?

I'm the senior manager in Finance, taking care of the company fundings, I work for a company called Tipco Asphalt, which is in Asphalt business. Asphalt is a construction material.

• Which advice could you give to young women who hesitate to start engineering studies ?

Firstly I think if it is a suject that you really like, because the engineering field deals with a lot of technical knowledge, technical background. And if you think you like it, then go for it. And I think it's good to get the world to know that women can do good, can be successful in this technical field, which we use to believe it was work for men.

• What has been your biggest difficulty as a woman engineer ?

As a woman engineer, I think the biggest one is to get recognition from subordinates who are men. I think the ides that men are better than women is the thing we have to pass and we have to prove that we can do it, and the recognition from the male subordinates

• What has been your biggest satisfaction as a woman engineer ?

Finally, I think I can get recognition from peers, and technicians and workers think now that a woman can be a good supervisor, and they are happy to work with.

• What is your next challenge ?

Next challenge, frankly speaking I switch the carieer from technical to business, and my next challenge is to be successful in this new job, and I think, I believe, I can do it!



Interview with Chitmanee Chiranantaratana

1st PART: Woman’s history comprehension/understanding

• Can you present yourself in a few words and explain us what is your job/responsibilities?

I’m taking care of logistic supply and processing. Another side of my job is commercial, and another is operations. I have to deal with the plants and factories. I must have the technical background but not so deep. And on the other operations I have to understand it as well, for the ships for example, because Tipco has its own ships to carry bitumen. We have to coordinate with the refineries as well.  We are not fully responsible of this but we have to understand the operations as well in order to work together. I manage 3 men and 1 woman.

• How did you come to engineering and sciences?

My bachelor degree is in English. My master degree is in Business Administration. I learnt the technical part here in the company.

Firstly I didn’t join the company for the technical position, but for the job of secretary. I started with processing, we have to buy machines and material in countries like USA or Sweden, and I could use my ability in English. And then the more I work the more I learnt in technical. I don’t know deep technical but I know the general. I like to be in contact with the technical part, but sometimes if too technical I may not understand everything, like for chemical for example. My colleague explained me a lot, and on my side I’m willing to learn too!

After my bachelor degree, I worked in Association of Thai industries, so I met higher management level. When I attend the meeting, I could learn from this also. That is why I was interested by this kind of technical company. So I entered the company as a secretary and then after Tipco gave me the opportunity to be processor. And with this company I could continue my business bachelor degree during night class.

• What do you like in this company?

My work handle with bitumen, and there are not a lot of women in this field, and when I attend the meeting there are mostly men and I am proud! And it is good to be a woman in negotiation, because men in front of men the negotiation could be tough! And when I travel with men to visit refinery or jobsite, they welcome us very well. Even if in these cases we have to prove we are not fragile, not scared to go to the top of tanks for example.

• Did you have to face any difficulty as a woman in your studies/in your job? Or do you think being a woman facilitated it?

Yes, sometimes men do jokes and it’s difficult to get along with them. Or at night they may go and drink beer. Well I don’t have problem with beer, but it’s just that it is sometimes difficult to get acceptance from the men. When I interview women for jobs I often ask if they can drink, just to see if they have to face the situation how they would react. In general they answer that normally they don’t drink, but for some occasions it’s not a problem.

• What are the special qualifications you need to have for your job?

Firstly we have to be fluent in English because we have to deal with overseas refinery and suppliers, and our working environment is more and more international. And also we need negotiation skills. On the technical background actually it is more a plus. Ability to learn is sufficient!

• What are your everyday motivations?

My motivation is to stay at this position and to be accepted in this industry, because the acceptance, the recognition is not easy.

• Do you have to move abroad for your job?

I didn’t have to move to other countries, but I have a lot of contacts with them: China, Korea, and Singapore. I don’t have to move to work there for a long time but I have to visit them sometimes, like ¾ times at the year. I move for around 2/3 days, it depends. Yes, it makes me think that for this position you mustn’t be scared to travel alone. The woman I manage is not scared either. It’s good because I want the girl to be my successor, because she is better in English. She is tough, independent. She is from the marine business. And she learns very quickly so it’s good for the company.

• Could you tell us professional realizations you are proud of?

Most of the people in this field are men, and my staff and I are the only 2 girls, and we don’t mind to learn technical things. And I think the management trust on me. And I’m proud that I did nothing wrong during my work with money under the table or things like this. And I’m really happy my colleagues explained me a lot with the technical side.

2nd PART:  General debate on woman engineer: differences and new things a woman can bring in a male team

• Do you think men and women work differently? Could you give us concrete examples (personal works, project works)?

I think men and women have different points of interest. And when you begin a negotiation, it’s always good in the Asian way to talk about common points of interest. We have to read the newspaper to be able to talk about something else than the business. And our voice is not so loud and doesn’t fright them, and we smile a lot, so it’s good to be a woman in negotiation because men feel at ease with us. Of course we have to negotiate hard and to have strong analysis, but the meeting is more pleasant for men when it is us. And another thing is the physical. I’m short, and when I have to travel my colleague help me with my luggage! Lucky me with my colleague!

For the communication between men and women, it depends on individual. Some women are too feminine and so they cannot get along with the working environment with many many men. If you are too weak, if you cannot so this or this, it will be difficult. At least you need to be strong at certain point to get acceptance.  And a common weakness to the women is that we are emotional, sensitive. We have to control a lot our temper. By nature we are less tempered. For example when you drive a car, you can see that women lose their temper really easily. For me it is not so difficult because in my family I’m the older so I’m leader by nature. And during my studies I worked with rural communities so I learnt to adapt my behavior and language. Yes, communications skills depend on individual.

• Do you think that gender diversity in a team is helpful for working atmosphere and/or is linked to team performance?

I prefer to have a team with men and women. But men are not so well organized like women. And women can look more on details than men. But men have power, they can carry heavy stuffs! All the paperwork, women are better. Men are not so careful. Men look more on big pictures.

Vidéo

• Can you present yourself in a few words ?

Hello, I'm responsible for logistic supply and processing at Tipco Asphalt public limited company, our company is involving in the manufacturer of Asphalt,

I'm dealing with refinery, with ships, and the company business is also involved in the road construction as well.

• Which advice could you give to young women who hesitate to start engineering studies ?

My personal view is that it could be a good challenge to prove to the worl that the women can do and also you'll feel the good feeling when you'll be recognized by

the men who worked with you. I think the benefits of the women is that we can, for little things, are more delicate than men.

• What has been your biggest difficulty as a woman engineer ?

The biggest difficulty I think should be that by nature, the women are mostly emotional, so you have to control your emotions very well.

• What has been your biggest satisfaction as a woman engineer ?

I think my biggest satisfaction is to be recognized by the men because in this field (bitumen and road construction) we are not many women.

But my job is not pure operations, half of it the commercial and the negociation for the prices or to get the supply, but in other part is the operations,

So there are more men in this business.

• What is your next challenge ?

My next challenge is to go to the highest management level, now I'm at the middle. We have to prove that we are tough enough and also we are capable and open minded to learn,

I think I need to have the twice efforts than the men have to do to go to the highest management level.